Instant Reaction Thread: Sixers-Celtics Trade

This is an instant reaction Facebook chat thread to the Boston-Philadelphia trade from last night between two of my buddies and I. They know their stuff. Ty is a Sixers fan, drawn in by Allen Iverson, and has the according fan eccentricities. Trevor is a Blazers fan from Eugene, and is far more measured in his takes. It’s been lightly edited for formatting because I’m a sucker for capitalizing proper nouns. This mostly covers Boston and Philadelphia, with some opinions on the draft, the Blazers, and other miscellaneous NBA things.

Ty Livingston (@3swant) , Trevor Smith (@TrevorDSmith27), Connor Williamson (@conconwillia)

Sat 7:24pm

Ty: What do you think of all this Fultz business? You pumped? yes. yes. yes

i’ve been up since 8 am and was out til 4. i watched his pointless workout on the livestream this morning. if its #3, Lakers unprotected, and the 2021 Sixers pick as reported i’d do it 100/100

if [Boston] wants the unprotected Sacramento pick too….. i dunno. that’s murky, more just scary. the Sac pick gives the Sixers 1 more chance

it’s nuts that going into the commercial break of draft [lottery] night the odds were in Sixers favor to get Fultz without having to give up any future picks. Embiid, Fultz, Simmons and any 3 and D you can find and you’re literally Cavs light with Embiid instead of Tristan Thompson and Simmons instead of LeBron. Fultz is going to be as good as Kyrie. maybe not as good of a shooter, but he will be in the same breathe as the upper echelon of point guards, Harden-like.

David Aldridge broke it. it’s all but official like 10 minutes ago.

Trevor: Yeah I think I’m with you. Fultz is gonna be sick. But everything is gonna come down to Embiid’s health for Philly either way.

Ty: yeah, pretty much, although even if not…i’ve been in my underwear in bed all day. and today couldn’t really get any better.

Trevor: Sixers will be must watch next year.

Ty: Simmons and Fultz plus room for 2-3 max guys, and the future Sac pick, plus all our own picks (assuming Embiid does get injured, they’ll still be high).

Trevor: Fultz, Saric, Simmons, Embiid

Ty: its coming, the Sixers are coming. Fultz, Simmons, Embiid, Covington. TJ MCCONNELL.

Saric i would still trade to some dumbass team that thinks he’s better than he is. but i fucking love dario. also LOL at Lakers offering Randle + #2 pick this year. gtfo.

Trevor: Randle sucks

Ty: like you’re not gonna be forced to overpay him on a 16-17 million a year contract this next offseason. randle blows and has no place on any good team. connor where you at? probably passed out from all the excitement. the Sixers are where the Timberwolves wish they were.

of both teams top 7 young players (including dunn and lavine) Sixers have 3/4 best.

Trevor: Maybe

Ty: and 3 better than anything on the Lakers.

Trevor: Yeah Lakers blow.

Ty: Wiggins is just counting stats

Trevor: For now. I still think Wiggins is a future all-star.

Ty: Bucks are the only young team with a shot at the Sixers barring health and they still need lots of help for Giannis. idgaf about all-star. i think he will be too.

Trevor: deserving* all-star.

Ty: i don’t think he creates enough, rebounds enough, makes winning plays enough, or anything of that nature.

Trevor: Dude’s still only 22.

Ty: trade him, time to rebuild. maybe they can get Kevin Love for him.

Trevor: Talking basketball makes me depressed that I still have to watch Evan Turner for 3 more years.

Ty: Don’t worry Allen Crabbe is going to magically become good. if i’m blazers i sell fucking high on damien and build around CJ. you could sell to the Celtics even once they realize that IT will never be the same and was never gonna get them far enough anyway. or sell high to someone else and try to dump ET too.

Trevor: Man I love Dame.

Ty: love hurts, sometimes love means letting go.

Trevor: Sometimes my brain tells me that would be a smart move, sometimes it doesn’t. But whenever I think about it I can only think that that would be a sad day in Portland.

Ty: his player archetype is overrated and he could get net a ridiculous return. that being said i wouldn’t trade the Iverson years for anything.

Connor: damn i cannot catch up here.

Trevor: Fultz trade thoughts? Should Portland trade Dame? Those are the only 2 topics of conversation.

Connor: Fultzzzz. I like the idea of that team a lot. They still have too many combo 4’s.

Ty: as in 2? or are you including RoCo?

Connor: Honestly they could help fix the league’s bottleneck there unloading Saric, RoCo.

Ty: i’d trade Dario so fast.

Connor: They need actual wings and guards, but like, take your pick on guards these days

Ty: don’t think i’d trade Cov he’s dynamic on D.

Connor: That’s a really interesting decision. Do you go playmaking or D? can you wait until Dario displays a shooting tough to decide, if he does at all. Huge question for them. For Philly, this is more or less the team now which is cool

Ty: i mean ideally keep them and everyone gels and it’s all amazing.

Connor: Hahahaha maybe. Boston, just jesus. What a play. Kicking the can down the road again. Perfect cap move.

Ty: depends a lot on how much Ben Simmons can guard [and who he can guard].

Connor: [ignoring Ty’s astute Simmons comment] Great asset management [from Boston].

Ty: yeah its a fucking great move by them really. can pick up someone big. could they potentially add GH [Gordon Hayward, not George Hill] and PG13. fuck all the PG13<JB hype.

Connor: Ummm yeah, might say something about how they view 2018 draft, might say something about how they view 2017 FA, might say something about how they view Fultz.

Probably all but who knows how much of each.

Ty: i like thinking Ainge is a shit drafter, but i hate everything Boston-LA.

Connor: Duuuude. PG’s be a better fit I think. Boston sports are annoying but I love the celtics haha. PG, just in terms of guarding Warriors’s

Ty: oh yeah.

Connor: and shooting the 3 to stick with them. and guarding LeBron and shooting the 3 to stick with them.

Ty: he’s great catch and shoot too.

Trevor: I kinda just think it’s just pure math for them. Like they might really like Fultz but at the end of the day they say “even if we like him, top picks still have a high degree of variability” and they take the extra pick.

Connor: I totally agree. especially since they have so much certainty in the assets available in FA vs. draft.

Ty: PG13 is the fucking man. plus they can take Jackson (or isaac!!!!) and whoever next year.

Connor: Like, they have a real shot at 2 dudes which is a super high expected value. And they HAVE to use that space before it’s gone forever. Same with Philly in next 2-3 years.

Ty: Jackson or Isaac at 3 for Celtics?

Connor: ISAAC. I’m an Isaac guy. I get it with Jackson and I think he’s good.

Ty: i LOOOOVE Isaac. perfect for Celts. rim protector-shooter-defender.

Connor: Exactly. God Boston could just have a Sixers team in 4 years

Trevor: I actually went backwards on Isaac compared to most people. I really liked him during the college season, but cooled more by the end. Think I would take Jackson. But I like them both.

Connor: If he can be Durant-ish defensively, without the high usage rate offensively, I think that actually increases his defensive value because of the energy economy. I kind of like defense-oriented draftees because of that.

Trevor: I mostly just think Isaac’s rim protection+defense is going to take longer to come around than most people.

Connor: Agree. Like he’s either going to get postered or not even try to get up against those huge dudes.

Trevor: Maybe he gets there eventually, but there are going to be several frustrating years where he gets bullied and looks lost way too much

Connor: I agree with that.

Ty: i actually don’t think i like Jackson (i like him more than Jaylen Brown) but i cooled off hard on him. don’t buy his shot, don’t like his length, and don’t really like his strength that much think he’s gonna get knocked around

Connor: And if he [Isaac] doesn’t get there offensively, will he have the confidence to keep working hard as hell and balling?

Ty: yeah he is like a baby giraffe kinda.

Connor: I get what you’re saying there.

Ty: he will probably never have crazy ball handling either (Isaac) he shows flashed but not even really enough to be a tertiary creator. that part worries me.

Connor: Yeah I like him as a straight line driver probably. My thing with Isaac on offense is just can he be a good passer? can he finish at the rim? will the handle improve? [This is probably a lot of people’s thing as well, not just mine.]

Ty: DSJ is gonna be Lillard good.

Connor: He’s a very similar athlete. I haven’t seen enough to know anything other than that haha

Ty: FUUUUCK. it’s the Kings pick, but with protections i think. [News keeps trickling in about the trade, previously we were under the impression that it was three picks, as had been reported up to this point in the night]

Trevor: Most interesting hypothetical in NBA right now I think: Who would you choose to build with between Fultz/Simmons?

Ty: Simmons. but both’s cool too. Simmons is the only reasonable LeBron comparison in years. since LeBron.

Trevor: It’s still a stretch. It’s more reasonable than anybody else has been, but Simmons isn’t gonna have nearly the speed and explosiveness of LeBron.

Ty: think he walks into the league as a top 7 passer. i think he’s got almost the speed, but yeah not the explosion. if he’s a 6’10” rondo which is a bad case scenario he’s still gonna be ridiculous.

Trevor: and while “LeBron w/o the game breaking explosiveness” is still a great player, it’s the fact that he can just physically overwhelm anybody in the league when he turns it on makes the passing and game IQ 2x as effective. LeBron comparisons should just never be allowed again, haha. But yeah I think I choose Simmons > Fultz too.

Connor: Yeah no more LeBron comps haha. i’d probably go Simmons too, just with the two way ceiling being higher

Ty: yeah i agree no more LeBron comps. like a Magic Johnson. i’m interested how it will change the Ben Simmons the PG plan Brett Brown had.

Connor: He or Fultz runs the second unit?

Ty: yeah

Connor: Is it weird that I care what happens to TJ?

Ty: kinda like like Manu and Tony Parker. Ben Simmons is just a really really big Tony Parker. Or something hahaha.

Connor: They’ll both start I assume. Ben Simmons is Ben Simmons. [Trying to end the player comps] We probably haven’t see what he’s going to be.

Ty: i def care what happens to TJ. TJ is a wonderful backup PG. no, Simmons is like a Tony Parker/short armed 6’10” Rondo mix.

Connor: I feel like he’s going to be much more similar to like a 90’s player because I don’t think he’s going to shoot haha [Simmons, giving into Ty’s need for player comps]

Ty: needs to get his 3pt % up (possible). who TJ or Ben Simmons?

Trevor: I think Simmons needs to be an elite rebounder to be an elite player. His prototype is kind of Blake Griffin-y in the sense that he could be what Blake wants to be – grab the board, lead the break and run much of the half court offense, only score on dunks. But Simmons will be a better handler and passer from day 1 than Blake is after years of focusing on it.

Ty: yeah fully agree. god i miss Blake dominating.

Trevor: Damn this is the most exciting draft in years.. So many guys I like

Ty: Clarification on deal: Besides its 2017 FRP, Philly sends ’18 Lakers pick w/ protections. If it doesn’t convey, 76ers send 2019 Kings pick. via WOJ. ahahahahahaha. what a fucking trade. it’s like reasonably fair.

Trevor: Woah. Yeah that’s interesting

Ty: and i still get to extra root for the Lakers to suck. i love hating the Lakers

Connor: I like that Griffin comp. [Totally given into my own heuristic need for comps. Trevor’s was quite reasonable, to be fair.]

Ty: schadenfreude is like a top 3 emotion real talk.

Connor: Oh that makes the trade a lot worse for Boston. [Duh] Not bad, but worse than great.

Ty: Simmons is like a taller Blake Griffin with LeBron like qualities and a wtf is that accent. for the record i got my TTP tattoo before any of this went down. [Ty does in fact have a TTP tattoo on his foot.]

Connor: I can attest.

Trevor: Interesting question though: does this trade happen if Hinkie is still in charge? Probably not. Do you actually have a TTP tattoo?

Ty: yeah probably not TBH. yeah.

Trevor: That’s awesome. “The 2018 Lakers pick to BOS has protections on top and bottom that could keep it in Philly, and if so, then 2019 Kings’ pick goes to Boston.”

Protections on top and bottom is interesting.

Ty: i wonder if it’s 3 or 5. probably 3. goddamn that makes the Sac pick untradable. wonder what Celtics do with it.

Connor: Yeah that’s the most interesting part [probably not actually, but very interesting.] It definitely changes my read of Boston’s intentions. Now even more on the FA game than trade. Makes sense. If you win FA, which you can only do now, you get someone dope for 4 years. Trade for Butler, 2 years and you give something up. Plus you still have assets to trade for him.

Trevor: Yeah they’re definitely going to at least spin the wheel in FA before making a trade

Connor: I think there’s a really tight asset management line here and they walked it well.

Ty: 2-5 protected is super solid. fair i think. hate that the Lakers will probably go 2 again. oh wait Lonzo is gonna make all his teammates shoot 5% better right?

Connor: i mean maybe, not impossible.

Ty: joking. i just want the Celtics to royally lose this trade with the Kings somehow becoming good in 19′ and the Lakers drafting 1 overall next year. god boston could really draft 1-2 next year. [To be clear: LA has permanently lost this pick. It’ll either go to Boston or Philly next year.]

Connor: They could have near Sixers-level young talent in 3 years.

Ty: easy

Connor: Plus their current roster just 3 years older. Like, what is this?

Ty: although this is their last year of picks next year and this. so they’ve really gotta hit.

Connor: We’ll see with Brown. They also have assloads of seconds. Not likely stars but still.

Ty: hit next year should be easy. i hate brown i think he’s an athlete and he thinks he’s smarter than he is and has a low bbiq and a weak handle. maybe they get Doncic and Porter next year. probably Jackson this year one would think?

Connor: They could also just do this again next year with one of their picks.

Trevor: Problem is they’re gonna have two rosters full of NBA players and nowhere to keep them all.

Connor: Two way. Stash, like the second round guys could all be stashes. [Although it seems like fewer international guys are willing to be stashed.]

Ty: yeah they’ve gotta do something with Crowder and Bradley too and IT. i mean i only like Bradley of that bunch.

Connor: Crowder has like three more years. We’ll see what happens this summer. If they stick this pick and signed Hayward, this was like the optimal outcome for them. But yeah IT decision one year away.

Trevor: Jeez they really could be unreasonably loaded soon.

Connor: Yeah it’s crazy.

Ty: and still be like barely better than the Wizards. Bucks might be better soon too.

Connor: Bucks have more cap concerns and less talent/assets hahaha

Trevor: Bucks have Giannis. Which may be the trump card in the “most promising future” discussion right now.

Connor: But Giannis is the best bet of the bunch so we’ll see. Agree.

Trevor: Although the possibility of getting Doncic AND Porter next year is pretty mouth-watering

Connor: Or Doncic and Bamba depending on how next year plays out. [Or Porter and Bamba for that matter]

Ty: or they could get neither and just have a roster of “winning players.” Marcus Smart/Jaylen Brown/Josh Jacksons. which is my ideal future Celtics team.

Connor: Yeah I mean the winner of this trade very well could win the post-LeBron East. Unlike any team in the Post-Jordan East haha. So that’s dope for the league. I feel like both Philly and Boston’s future look more certain after this.

Ty: yeah.

Connor: Which might be counter intuitive, but it feels like a trade is less likely now that Boston can’t really trade those handcuffed ones. [I think they technically could trade the whole protected set, but not one half of the protection. At the very least it complicates things.]

Ty: god so much still rests on Embiid’s ability to stay healthy and not try to go too balls to the walls for loose balls/layups/etc. how do the Sixers dump Okafor? Can’t Boston just take him?

Connor: Yeah that’s something I just can’t even fathom. Like the 60 people for whom that will swing their life. Can’t imagine being Embiid himself.

Trevor: God I remember a few hours last season when it sounded like Okafor was going to Portland.

Connor: Hahaha. He’s not come up one time in this discussion. Will there ever be a wider DRTG gap that the one between the Cov/Embiid and Saric/Okafor tandems next season?

Ty: probably never will be. Tim Duncan and like, me.

The finale of the conversation involves Ty making an such a ridiculous statement about Willie Cauley-Stein and DeMarcus Cousins that it will not be published.



2 thoughts on “Instant Reaction Thread: Sixers-Celtics Trade

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